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38 watchers
21 Apr
10:32am, 21 Apr 2025
6,427 posts
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K5 Gus
So have they taken away the option to instruct the driver to hand the place back, or did they just choose to use a different penalty yesterday ?
SPR
21 Apr
10:35am, 21 Apr 2025
47,601 posts
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SPR
Quite happy for the instruction not to exist. Teams have the option to avoid a penalty by sorting it themselves, if they take the risk of not doing that, then any penalty should in theory be harsher than the gain.
21 Apr
10:36am, 21 Apr 2025
3,747 posts
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RunningRonnie
K5 Gus wrote:So have they taken away the option to instruct the driver to hand the place back, or did they just choose to use a different penalty yesterday ?

Yeah, I think they did that last year. A team has to make that decision themselves. If they don't, they get a penalty.
21 Apr
1:19pm, 21 Apr 2025
162 posts
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LanaD
It was interesting to see the stewards give Max 5 sec penalty instead of 10 as it was first lap - think Lawson got the full 10 second penalty later on in race.

Not sure if Red Bull thought that Max would 'drive fast' and close the gap (or extend whilst he was in front) - if they did, it didn't work.

Lando did good to come up the field, as always would have been a good race if he hadn't crashed in quali.
21 Apr
1:57pm, 21 Apr 2025
27,132 posts
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larkim
SPR wrote:Quite happy for the instruction not to exist. Teams have the option to avoid a penalty by sorting it themselves, if they take the risk of not doing that, then any penalty should in theory be harsher than the gain.

But the issue is where there's a 60:40 decision in the eyes of a steward it will seen as 40:60 by the team so they tend not to sort it themselves; especially RBR.

If the positions had been reversed yesterday and Piastri had disappeared up the road there's a decent chance he'd have more than overcome the penalty impact based on pure pace so the penalty effectively becomes zero. If the car that has gained the advantage is forced to give the place up there is far less opportunity for a competitive advantage to be retained despite the penalty. Bundle was making that point during the race yesterday and it made sense to me at least.
21 Apr
2:27pm, 21 Apr 2025
1,929 posts
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Akie
K5 Gus wrote:So have they taken away the option to instruct the driver to hand the place back, or did they just choose to use a different penalty yesterday ?


I was told by someone, havent confirmed if its true, that the only the race director can instruct drivers to swap places under a safety car (or for lapped cars to unlap themselves) and they are separate from the stewards. Essentially so the stewards had no authority to ask for the switch under the SC.
22 Apr
3:52pm, 22 Apr 2025
574 posts
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DaveG
I wonder what would have happened without the accident. No driver would give back a position without the pit wall telling them to. It's normal to wait a couple of laps for TV replays if close. So Max might have been letting the pit wall guide him.

Given Yuki crashed and their focus was there, they might not have got round to discussing giving the place back until the Safety Car was released. At that point he wasn't allowed to give it back.

It seemed so obvious he gained an advantage I'd be surprised if he wasn't told by the team to give it back (no doubt whilst arguing Oscar deserved a penalty for running him off the road).

The rules actually mean it Max wouldn't be punished if giving it back on lap two, then using DRS to retake. If Max was going to give it back without instruction, he hadn't reached the place where he would likely have done it either.
23 Apr
9:11am, 23 Apr 2025
27,149 posts
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larkim
Andrew Benson on the BBC says that teams are entitled to talk to race director's assistants about giving positions back and get an "opinion" about it. If RBR did that then they either heard more 50:50 in the race director's assistant's opinion than they should have, or they just simply ignored them.

bbc.co.uk

After the controversy of the title-deciding race in Abu Dhabi in 2021, it was decided that teams should no longer be able to talk directly to the race director during a grand prix.

However, they can still talk to his assistants in race control and discuss incidents. So when a driver does a manoeuvre that looks borderline, teams have three options.

They can choose proactively to give the place back - as McLaren did with Lando Norris against Lewis Hamilton in Bahrain.

They can get in touch with race control and ask for an opinion on the move, and then make a decision as to what to do about it.

Or they can plough on and hope for the best, as Red Bull did in Jeddah.
5 May
9:08am, 5 May 2025
52,670 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Plenty of action there. Glad it was all on track not stewards! Great patience and control by Piastri. Norris just a bit impetuous for me. Verstappen as usual making the best of a lower performance car, but delighted to see Russell best of rest behind McLarens. Williams looking good but Ferrari clearly frustrated not to be a top 3 team. :-) G
5 May
9:13am, 5 May 2025
3,772 posts
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RunningRonnie
I feel like McLaren are bringing home the goods, but for some reason they are making it harder than it needs to be. I think this particular win for Piastri over Norris is significant.

Great work for George. As usual, keeps himself out of trouble, capitilise on any luck and just makes sure he is in the right place at the right time. Good tyre management and kept max just out of reach.

Great to see Williams improving.

Impressive from Kimi this weekend too.

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