Oct 2018
6:09pm, 18 Oct 2018
1,448 posts
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J2R
I've heard variants of the "better to be poor outside the EU than rich in it" sentiment before. And you know what? It's bollocks, isn't it? It's just one of those fine things people say because they like the sound of it. The people who are saying this, when they do find themselves poorer as a result of leaving the EU, will absolutely not feel happy about it, but will complain bitterly and find someone to blame other than themselves.
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Oct 2018
6:27pm, 18 Oct 2018
8,182 posts
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rf_fozzy
Ah, but J2R, don't you realise that it'll all be because of the nasty EU. We've elevated victimhood to a new level in this country. Unless you actually are really a victim of something. Then you don't matter. I've remembered what the (TV talking head policitian) Brexiteers remind me of: "There's only one way to win a campaign: SHOUT, SHOUT AND SHOUT AGAIN!" (Duke of Wellington, Blackadder III) |
Oct 2018
6:42pm, 18 Oct 2018
4,674 posts
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BanjoBax
If only we could get the grand old Duke to give the Brexiteers a kicking  "why I hardly touched the man"
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Oct 2018
9:47am, 19 Oct 2018
9,566 posts
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Cerrertonia
The remain/leave split was something like 2:1 among people in paid employment, IIRC, so it seems entirely plausible that many leave voters would be relatively unconcerned about the economy.
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Oct 2018
11:04am, 19 Oct 2018
1,974 posts
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Fellrunning
That'll be Michael "You're only supposed to blow the doors off" Cane who abandoned the UK for tax purposes.... A real expert in every sense.... |
Oct 2018
11:35am, 19 Oct 2018
29,397 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
I do enjoy this thread. Informed, intelligent, challenging and accepting of challenges and... of course, a sprinkling of Fetchland irreverence and/or silliness. Keep up the good work/play everyone. I'm going to move to Bali. Or Switzerland. Or somewhere fully outside UK and normal, connected society. Like Cornwall. Oh, hang on...
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Oct 2018
12:43pm, 19 Oct 2018
166 posts
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paul0
Cerretonia - yes, leavers not in full-time employment may think they're unconcerned about the economy, but if they're in anyway dependent on the social welfare system or even public services, then they'll still be affected when the economy shrinks, tax-take falls and spending falls.
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Oct 2018
1:45pm, 19 Oct 2018
13,398 posts
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Chrisull
Cornwall. Haha. One day I should blog about the Cornwall separatist/nationalist stuff, it's a real eye opener, some people take it very seriously. But basically the history of the UK says Athelstan pretty much integrated Cornwall into the UK in 930AD, and that was the end of it. Cornish history says otherwise (with some interesting proof - I am not knocking it), that Cornwall was its own country until the Perkin Warbeck rebellion 1491-99, or even the prayer book rebellion of 1549 (so basically another 500-600 years). Which is all fine. Down with the King and all that. But then you get the Cornish siding with the Royalists in the Civil war just 100 years after that and being a bolthole for escaping nobles fleeing the Parliamentarians. And pretty much since then the Cornish have been very conservative, very pro royalist, the Duchy owns much of the land in Cornwall, yet they still claim independence and this bolshy we are a country spirit. When South Wales/The North goes on strike with the unions and becomes hot bed of civil unrest, the Cornish, thanks to their share holding system are happy proto-capitalists. (* caveat there were strikes, and one of the first unions actually pretty much geographically starts where I live, but if you want a history of unionism, left wing resistance, look elsewhere). I genuinely can't figure it out, either you resist or you become part of the system/government. They seem to want to be part of the latter while claiming the former. |
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Oct 2018
2:41pm, 19 Oct 2018
8,183 posts
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rf_fozzy
Ok, so back to climate change for a moment. So the IPCC scientific report comes out and says we've got a lot of heavy lifting to do to stay within the limits of avoiding catastrophic (societal ending) climate change (within certain probabilistic modelling). A few days later the Tory govt (a) approves fracking (a whole brand new source of CO2, which in the US is built entirely on mountains of debt and likely to collapse in the next 3-5years https://jeremyleggett.net/2018/10/16/history-of-oil-and-gas-production-from-shale-in-pictures-and-charts-why-american-shale-is-heading-for-a-crash-and-fracking-in-the-uk-is-doomed-to-costly-failure-2/) and then (b) cuts grants to fully electric cars and zeroes out hybrid grants (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45831150) Today we get the report from the BEIS subcomittee that the 2040 "ban" on new petrol and diesel cars was hopeless unambitious (and hopelessly way behind not only other European countries, but also our CO2 targets for the inadequte 80% cuts by 2050*) bbc.co.uk Radio 4 did a really good, sober and insightful look at the energy industry on Tuesday (it's only a half-hour listen) bbc.co.uk What struck me was that the Energy Minster (Claire Perry) neither really understood the implications of her government's actions, nor did she actually sound like she cared. |
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Oct 2018
2:42pm, 19 Oct 2018
8,184 posts
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rf_fozzy
The first two links from my post above (since they've not copied properly). Here's the presentation on fracking: jeremyleggett.net And the BBC one on cuts to BEV and PHEVs: bbc.co.uk |
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