Cadence on Easy Runs
10 watchers
Jun 2024
8:45am, 8 Jun 2024
110 posts
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LS21
Hello all, After some advice/shared experiences from people who might have gone through a similar thing previously if possible. Bit of background. 50 years old, been running relatively seriously for 20+ years, usually quite high mileage, like my road Marathons etc. But I've historically been pretty hard on my body. The classic quite slow cadence, thus overstriding and the associated issues that brings. Mitigated to some degree by strength training, but my issues have been getting progressively worse of late - mostly the very top of my hamstrings. My form isn't horrific, but when tired I think I start to almost 'pivot' from my waist. So I'm effectively sticking my backside out, and end up with a posture like Mr Burns off the Simpsons. Thus the top of my hammies are massively overworked, and they've just given up! I've dabbled with trying to increase cadence many many times previously. But always given up cos I've found it pretty hard. I then revert back to my 'old' style mid-run and everything feels better, so I just do that again. The problem is recurrent injury and now very persistent pain. Pretty much every step of every run hurts. It's really quite debilitating, and when I've finished I can't even bend over to take my shoes off etc. I've reached a point where if I don't do something form-wise, then I won't even be able to run again, let alone race. So this time it feels like I've really GOT to bite the bullet and try and address my form issues. I'm finding it really quite hard tbh. I found this video which helped me quite a lot So I've been trying to follow that and run with a metronome. I'm up to about 173-175 steps per minute at the mo, which is really hard but I can just about do it. At a guess I think my old cadence for recoveries/easy running was about 160. Prob mid-high 160s for Marathons, maybe low 170s for an all out 5k (old watch so cadence isn't a feature on there). So my cadence has always increased as my speed does. But in the video attached he advocates the same cadence for all paces. The variance comes from your stride length. I did some strides this morn and hit 180 for those fairly ok. But it's the slow easy stuff I'm struggling with. Has anyone gone through this before? Is it a case of keep at it and eventually it will just click? I usually find the best advice comes from fellow runners who've experienced similar issues, so hoping to tap into that if anyone can help! Thanks 
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Jun 2024
10:23am, 8 Jun 2024
2,661 posts
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SailorSteve
Hi LS21 a quick look at your profile shows that you’re much quicker and younger than me but I’ll offer the following fwiw. - keep at it and eventually it will just click? - If your race schedule allows, maybe ‘force’ yourself to run shorter distances for a couple of months in order to avoid the ‘lapse’ into your more familiar stride as you tire? Perhaps that will help to keep a higher cadence for longer when you extend distance again? - I’m a 63yo shuffler who doesn’t wear a watch but I do listen to music when I run and I find 180bpm to be my comfy, marathon-cruising cadence. When I tire I shorten my stride to maintain that cadence for as long as I can. Well worth giving it an extended period of practice in my view. Best wishes with it👊 |
Jun 2024
10:45am, 8 Jun 2024
44,623 posts
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SPR
You've got to do what works for you but... Your form can improve and you don't have to overstride when running 160 and you can overstride at 180 if you're running with exactly the same form. Overstriding will be your foot swinging out in front of your knee. I'm not a believer in the same cadence at all paces maybe that works for some runs but most will increase a combination of stride length and cadence when changing pace. Couple of articles on this Steve Magness blog: scienceofrunning.com One from our own Canute: canute1.wordpress.com Maybe going down the 180 route will work for you but just pointing out that it isn't magic and you can run without overstriding at higher and lower cadences. |
Jun 2024
11:07am, 8 Jun 2024
17,230 posts
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jda
I started out running with a cadence around 160. I’m tall, long-legged, it felt natural but I was feeling laboured around the 25 min mark and never got into running. Around my early 40s I made the effort to run a bit more persistently, used a metronome to nudge up gradually to 180 (even for easy running) and simultaneously got much better at running. It probably has more to do with mileage than cadence of course but I certainly think the matter has helped. Nudging up one or two beats at a time may be easier than doing it in one jump. |
Jun 2024
11:27am, 8 Jun 2024
7,192 posts
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Little Miss Happy
I had to have running rehab a few years ago after giving myself hamstring tendinopathy. It involved strengthening my glutes and learning to engage them, strengthening my core (sounds like you might benefit from this too if you're collapsing in the middle when fatigued) and learning to run with a different stride. It took a long time but was well worth it as I went from breaking if I ran over about thirty five miles a week to being able to run over one hundred. I didn't consciously increase cadence but that was a by product.
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Jun 2024
11:30am, 8 Jun 2024
1,374 posts
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CasB
I can't speak to the cadence question (mine is slow, though has got fractionally quicker thanks to more fast track sessions) but I've also struggled with high hamstring niggles and had a hamstring tear a few years back. It won't be a surprise that the answer seems to be that pesky glute work but it has made a big difference and does take the effort off your hamstrings, so worth adding some glute activation and strengthening in if you're not doing it already. I can now tell the 'push' is coming from my glutes, and it makes a real difference getting up hills. Also some pilates-type core work, which will help with tucking your backside under rather than sticking out. Good luck, hope you can find what works for you!
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Jun 2024
11:30am, 8 Jun 2024
1,375 posts
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CasB
x-post with LMH - glad we seem to be saying the same thing
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Jun 2024
1:46pm, 8 Jun 2024
111 posts
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LS21
Thanks for the replies everyone - very much appreciated! Re the strength stuff. I think I'm actually decent in this regard. I do a lot of stuff in the gym (big compound exercises with heavy weights, such as squats and dead lifts), but then more isolated single leg stuff to compliment it. I think this is what's kept me going for so long to this point tbh! I could definitely do more (core in particular) - but I think my form is the root cause of this, so I need to address that. I've tried to do what jda suggests (increasing it a bit at a time), and it's mostly ok. Got up to low-mid 170s now. I can sustain that ok when running reasonably quickly. I'm just struggling to turn my legs over when the effort level should be lower. I think SailorSteve's point of 'jut stick at it' is probably the way forward. Long-term I'm not sure I'll stick to the same cadence for everything (maybe a variance of 10 beats between slow and fast stuff), but I need to increase it across the I have cut my mileage quite a bit in an effort to try and concentrate on this. Mostly 3-6 mile runs where I often stop mid-run to 're-set' myself (running on the spot to the cadence, then lean forward to start running and go again). It's definitely helping - this week is the first time in months where I've been relatively pain-free. But the runs where I've had issues are the slower, recovery type ones where my cadence has probably been a bit slower. I suppose that tells its own story. So I'll just stick at it and hopefully it will click. Thanks again for the input though - massively appreciated. |
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Jun 2024
4:55pm, 8 Jun 2024
7,193 posts
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Little Miss Happy
It's not just about strength or cadence LS21 - it's engaging the glutes as you run.
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Jun 2024
7:36pm, 8 Jun 2024
3,846 posts
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cackleberry
Run off-road and don't worry about it? Seriously though, it will help with strengthening your core and ankles, and rough ground makes you pick up your feet, but take shorter strides. Less over striding. Plus it's fun. |
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