Mar 2008
3:08pm, 21 Mar 2008
12,778 posts
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Pace is the killer on long runs. If this is your first mara and you haven't been endurance base building for long (less than a year or so) then you may well be running a bit too fast.
IMHO IanR, you should be doing your long runs at 9 to 9:30 pace so yes I'm not surprised you feel tired. I think you may benefit from doing the calcs again for your numbers re HRM training but if you STILL find you are running at less than 70 for 8:20 pace I'd use the rule of thumb I just gacve you because I did that based on your half mara performance. The tables are a guess and not very accurate. I'd say you look good for a 3:40 ish mara...
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Mar 2008
4:45pm, 21 Mar 2008
150 posts
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IanRunner
Thanks IanM ,
Do you think I should running slower than sub 70% for my recovery runs then? I've checked my calcs and they seem fine, the only thing that could happen would be my max heart heart rate isnt high enough, whch would bring my whr up not lower. I am feeling fairly comfortable during my sub 70% runs and feel as if I could go faster rather than breatless. Its just I've been reading a few articles about people training too fast for their mp and overtrained. I know with hr training you arent really looking at pace but my training runs are quite close to my mp. Thanks
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Mar 2008
9:42pm, 21 Mar 2008
2,950 posts
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hellen
Ian, sounds like you are doing my trick and reading too much and paniking!!!! Pz and Dou say somewhere that you shouldnt go too slow otherwise you will not get any training benefits from the run. If you are doing sub 70% then you are fine. However, is your whoel run sub 70% or just the average? I know for me I just make sure my av is sub 70% but really, if you are doing it properly you should be sub 70% the whole time. If you are doing that then you have no need (IMHO) to slow down any more.
Much better run today after all the carp ones lately. The schedule said 10 miles with 5x1200m at 5km pace. I think 5k pace is around 8/mile although havnt done a 5km apart from race for life when I didnt run. Decided to set off and if after 4 miles my pace was not too bad for the HR then I woudl do the intervals.
It was a bit difficult to tell really as it was so windy but I felt ok so went for it.
Last time I did this session I had 90s recovery, not sure why as schedule said 2mins, so this time had 2 mins. The odd numbered intervals were into the strongest headwind I have ever run into so the pace was quite differnt for the odd and even numbered intervals. I cheated on the last one as I didnt want 3 into headwind and one backwind so turned around halfway into the last one!!! Average pace for intervals was 8/mile (15s slower than last time) Av HR for intervals 87% (same as last time). So all in all quite pleased as I can blame the wind for being slower than usual and dont need to anaylse!!!!!
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Mar 2008
10:01pm, 21 Mar 2008
12,796 posts
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IanR,
your recovery runs sound ok it's the long runs you need to watch I reckon. Slow down on those defo. Does seem weird that if you are managing 8 mins/mile at below 70%whr then you must be fitter than you think? You should be capable of a faster half and marathon at that rate!
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Mar 2008
11:42pm, 21 Mar 2008
151 posts
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IanRunner
Thanks again.
I hope I will be. I suppose Im just being over cautious with it being first marathon and trying to go for a certain pace. I've been really suprised by how hard marathon training is, in comparison to a half marathon. So Im making sure I wont under estimate the marathon itself.
Its probably my best chance of doing a marathon with proper training as my wife is expecting in September so Im trying to make the best of it now!
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Mar 2008
7:08am, 22 Mar 2008
1,476 posts
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april_runner
Talking about running slow enough for long marathon training runs...I ran my long runs too fast for my Autumn marathon and this time around I am actually running them at the same, or if anything, slightly slower, pace. Obviously I am a lot fitter and faster since August/September last year - but it's weird to be doing the training at the same pace. I have to say I feel a lot more comfortable and relaxed at 8:30-8:45 LSR pace now.
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Mar 2008
4:43pm, 23 Mar 2008
326 posts
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The Jogger
I just did a 16 miler today, only the second time I've done that. My calves are very tight, my AHR was 150 pace 10:55 HR 70% WHR but it did feel tougher than usual, is this common when increasing long runs. I did 14 last Sunday and it wasn't as ba and 12 last Friday and that was ok to......
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Mar 2008
4:57pm, 23 Mar 2008
95 posts
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StuartM
IRS Maybe if you are at the upper end of your training volume 12 and 16 in 3 days is a bit too close together.
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Mar 2008
5:02pm, 23 Mar 2008
4,099 posts
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Lumsdoni
2 good sessions recently. 3 miles on treadmill. 10.30 pace 65%
Today did 6m. 4m at 7.50 pace. 85% 2m warm down.
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Mar 2008
5:05pm, 23 Mar 2008
327 posts
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The Jogger
I was thinking that but that's what's on the program just drank a load of water and calf feels a bit better, maybe I didn't drink enough, I had a 500ml of luco sport on thre run.
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