EU Referendum - In or Out? Vote here

70 watchers

Chrisull Jul 2016 10:35pm, 6 Jul 2016 9,354 posts	0 Chrisull I'm thinking of rejoining to vote against Corbyn, plenty of others doing that to.
FenlandRunner Jul 2016 10:39pm, 6 Jul 2016 9,315 posts	0 FenlandRunner So the 'new' labour members are Tories in disguise?
SFL Jul 2016 11:15pm, 6 Jul 2016 764 posts	0 SFL If you call anyone who knows that Socialism is undesirable a Tory, then that's possibly an accurate summary.
FenlandRunner Jul 2016 6:42am, 7 Jul 2016 9,319 posts	0 FenlandRunner And racist capitalism is the answer?
paul the builder Jul 2016 6:59am, 7 Jul 2016 5,675 posts	0 paul the builder It's ironic that politics certainly seems to be very black and white as far as you are concerned, FR.
DeeGee Jul 2016 8:27am, 7 Jul 2016 17,440 posts	0 DeeGee I'm a social democrat. Have always been a social democrat and always will be a social democrat. Consequently, I've just left Labour to rejoin the Liberal Democrats, who have got back to their Social Democratic roots. I joined Labour following Nick Clegg's wild lurch to the right. However, as a Union member who pays the political levy, I get to vote for the next Labour leader. I voted for Corbyn last time around.
Chrisull Jul 2016 8:43am, 7 Jul 2016 9,355 posts	0 Chrisull I don't believe Corbyn is radical enough. He's basically a gentlemanly SDP member with a few traditional old Labour values, but his areas of passion are things like nationalising the railways (which need doing), not replacing Trident, negotiating with extremists rather than bombing, quantative easing for the people and not a more reforming platform like PR, abolition of the House of Lords, and replacing it with a more democratic alternative, or a universal income. He is unable to carry the country with him on even his rather modest aims Furthermore I suspect a more centrist candidate is more likely to achieve radical change (doesn't mean at all likely) because they will come under less press scrutiny. Compare Milliband's £8 living wage pledge to Osborne's £9. (Yes I know tax credit cuts eat it all back up, but still it's making the big corporates choke on their Bollinger). I'm not for any instant holding up Osborne's reforming left wing credentials, but Milliband was crucified for suggesting £8 and Osborne barely raised an eyebrow with a higher figure. It's like in South Africa that the last apartheid era white government elected via racism under De Klerk actually did more for the rights of black workers than Nelson Mandela's first 100 days. Radicals are scrutinised for their extremism and often have to temper them when in power, where as conservatives and liberals get away with them. Blair's introduction of the minimum wage another case in point. It can be argued Ronald Reagan was the man who did more for nuclear disarmament than Gorby, he was allegedly never going to press the button after early exchanges and drove the reduction of arms and wanted desperately to come to a peace deal, despite his absurd on air gaffes like "let's bomb Poland". It's a contradiction I struggle with still, of course I still would rather have had Milliband and Mandela in charge even with this hindsight. But as Paul implies politics just simply isn't black and white.
Fellrunning Jul 2016 9:33am, 7 Jul 2016 1,693 posts	0 Fellrunning I'm actually a member of all three parties, and have been for a while. Why should a small number of people get to select the person who could potentially lead our country. Voted for Burnham, Tim Farron. Will vote for May because she's notionally the sanest.
jdarun Jul 2016 9:41am, 7 Jul 2016 967 posts	0 jdarun Considering the same - how much does it cost, Fellrunning? Mind you, I can't help thinking that all minds really ought to be focussed on sorting out the present clusterfuck of the referendum, rather than dicking about playing musical chairs within each party.
Fellrunning Jul 2016 9:46am, 7 Jul 2016 1,694 posts	0 Fellrunning Tory party is the most expensive at £25, Lib Dems have a minimum of £12 but suggest £20, Labour was free because I retain my old Union membership from when I had a "Proper" job. Set up a junk email account on Gmail or something and use that address as they send you loads of crap by email.