Long runs for slow first-time marathon runners

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RevBarbaraG Jan 2014 4:46pm, 20 Jan 2014 1,379 posts	0 RevBarbaraG Here's the thing:- how long does your long run really need to be? Received wisdom says build it up to 20 miles, preferably repeat a few times. Jeff Galloway takes you all the way up to 26 miles, 3 weeks before the day. Some people say you shouldn't do a training run that lasts longer than 2/3/3.5 hours. Post-calf strain, my long runs are around 14 min/mile pace. At that rate (even if I can keep it up), it's going to take me over 6 hours to finish. OTOH - London is flatter than a pancake, and where I run is hilly, and often a bit boggy and uneven, so hopefully that will help. Interested in hearing from others who have run their first marathon in 5 hours+, or who coach those who have. What was your longest run... how long did it take... and was it enough?
Johnny Blaze Jan 2014 4:51pm, 20 Jan 2014 20,527 posts	0 Johnny Blaze I have always tried for 220 lsrs as my maxes in the run up to a marathon. This is speaking as someone who treats every marathon as if it is his first. But you can complete a marathon without too much pain on less tan 220 if you have had reasonable mileage in the preceding period.
Johnny Blaze Jan 2014 4:53pm, 20 Jan 2014 20,528 posts	0 Johnny Blaze I would never do a 26 mile training run as preparation for a marathon - particularly not if you are a novice. It could seriously mess you up. Save that for the race itself.
monsenb1 Jan 2014 4:54pm, 20 Jan 2014 1,188 posts	0 monsenb1 Toughie that one.. If I were in your shoes I would do a distance/duration that would help encourage me to believe that I would actually be able to finish the race. 20 miiles @ 14 minute miles = 4hrs 40 mins..so if you get to do that once or twice before your race you might actually believe in yourself to complete.. At London you will run quicker and finish sooner but will probably still be out longer than in any training run. Good luck to you!
Pestomum Jan 2014 4:56pm, 20 Jan 2014 4,917 posts	0 Pestomum I did a 20 miler (Hal Higdon novice 1 plan) that took over 5 hours. Ended up with a sub 6 marathon and very glad I did the 20.
DerbyTup Jan 2014 5:00pm, 20 Jan 2014 9,089 posts	0 DerbyTup I think I'd want to do at least a couple of 4 hour runs, whatever the pace. When you're mixing up running and walking, training really is mainly about time on your feet. I think of it a bit like like saving in reverse. Everything helps
tom_craggs Jan 2014 5:00pm, 20 Jan 2014 2,469 posts	0 tom_craggs I have coached first time runners whose longest LR was 3hrs 30....run slower than MP, so never reaching 20 miles and they did really well. Similar to JB I would NEVER coach at first time runner to 26 miles before a marathon, in fact I wouldn't have top class runners doing that either as you will likely be tired on race day. For me over 4 hours there is a law of diminishing returns...(the impact on the rest of your training and potential tiredness on race day).
RevBarbaraG Jan 2014 6:27pm, 20 Jan 2014 1,382 posts	0 RevBarbaraG You're broadly telling me what I'm already thinking. FWIW, my plan currently has me alternating a long run one week with a medium-long run the other. Because the terrain where I run is so varied, I've set both a time and distance target for my long runs, and am happy if I meet either one. I'm building up to a longest run of 20 miles/4 hrs 30 minutes, which I aim to do twice before tapering. The last one is 3 weeks before the marathon. Sound about right?
DerbyTup Jan 2014 6:30pm, 20 Jan 2014 9,096 posts	0 DerbyTup I like your plan. The only cloud on the horizon is 'flat, fast' marathons (like London) are hard if you're used to hillier ground
FenlandRunner Jan 2014 6:36pm, 20 Jan 2014 324 posts	0 FenlandRunner A lot of people suggest more than 2.5 hours is a waste of time, but that might in relation to people who 'jog' twenty mile in that time