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Nov 2008
9:02pm, 10 Nov 2008
261 posts
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Pricey_
some people say smartarse 
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Nov 2008
9:14pm, 10 Nov 2008
1,894 posts
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april_runner
Children!!
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Nov 2008
9:44pm, 10 Nov 2008
4,566 posts
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hellen
Agree with Velo, I also peaked too soon this year and last year, had a good run at Ashby 20 both years, 5 weeks before FLM then went downhill. Am thinking of a Feb marathon this year so I hopefully wont peak too soon!
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Nov 2008
8:21am, 11 Nov 2008
10,459 posts
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If you did a say an 18 week schedule with 6 weeks = 24 in total then, aside from possibly getting bored I don't think it would give you any problems with exceeding a maximum performance level.
What *would* cause problems (although this would be a crazy thing to do! obv) would be if you did an 18 week schedule and then after that, added 6 weeks more worth of race sharpening. Once you hit a peak there is only so long you can race well/perform at that level before you have to call it a season.
Basically you can go on base building as long as you like but, once you hit a peak it won't last indefinitely.
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Nov 2008
8:31am, 11 Nov 2008
2,835 posts
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Marts
I picked the 24 week schedule for 2 reasons.
1. I've not really structured my training properly before and felt just bimbling around for 6 weeks before trying the 18week one wasn't a great idea for me
2. Was just keen to get started.
It will mean that many of my league races will now be MP+10% parts of my long runs so won't be 'racing' them.
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Nov 2008
9:16am, 11 Nov 2008
4,567 posts
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hellen
Just moving on from the how long a schedule one should follow.....
I was wondering about the progressive LRs, I havnt done them before but am going to do them this time round. I did my first one on Sunday, it was only a 12 mile run (it is 3 weeks since my last marathon so thats why it was a short one), i did the first 9 miles at 10.15/mile and the last 3 miles at around 9.15 (which is roughly my PMP). The last 3 miles felt quite hard. Not sure if that was because I am still recovering from the marathon or if it was due to being soaked to the skin and cold or if it ought to feel hard?!!!
How do peeps do their progressive LSRs (in terms of distances and pace in relation to MP)?
how often do you do them?
How hard does it feel when you do the last bit faster?
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Nov 2008
9:27am, 11 Nov 2008
10,466 posts
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I usually go for the first 5 miles how they come, going by feel and take it easy - could be around 9:00 for me.
After that I would aim for within 10-20% of marathon pace making sure that the last say 3 miles were at a good effort - (not necessarily fast but effort wise), at the moment the pace for that would be from 8:15 to 7:45 pace.
When I first started doing these, after say 16 miles my legs felt very tired, *but* after a number of weeks of doing these I began to be stronger towards the end of these runs.
Interestingly in the RR for serious runners book there is a guideline of every two out of three long runs should be these quality efforts, but in the Advanced marathoning book I haven't read this. The conclusion is therefore either 2/3 weeks or every week?!
Really though I would go by feel. If you are running high mileage weeks back to back then you may simply be too tired to do such a run every week - you may find it very hard to get down to that pace/maintain it, in which case you should ease off a bit. I think as you get stronger you can do them more often and recover quicker.
I remember I would get a little soreness the day after when I first started, but as I continued with them, it improved. Now I can do a hard 16 mile progression run with no soreness at all the next day.
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Nov 2008
12:56pm, 11 Nov 2008
196 posts
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MattTheRat
24 week schedule: I did this for Abingdon, the 24/70 plan. Chose it to maximise my chance of a sub-3 and because I was p*ssed off ater London was illness-affected. It worked, in that I did most of the mileage planned and I achieved my goal. But... Weeks 1-6 were great, weeks 16-24 were great, but the 10 weeks in the middle were really hard work (mentally). I felt that I'd been on this plan for months, but still had months to go until the marathon. The fact that it coincided with the summer holidays made it harder.
Progressive long runs: I do these, not every time, and they are hard. Variations that work for me are:
1. Run home faster than run out, generally feels OK. I'd run the first half at 7:45-8:00, 2nd half at 7:15-7:30
2. Run 3-5 miles at MP in the 2nd half, but normally slow down again for the last 2-3 miles. Other miles at about 7:45mm
MP for me was 6:45.
I did a full progressive 20 miler once (5 mile sections at 7:30, 7:15, 7:00 & 6:45). Really hard work, and I felt brilliant straight afterwards, but collapsed about 4 hours later and had to go to bed at 6pm - made me less than popular at home. Didn't do that again!
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Nov 2008
1:19pm, 11 Nov 2008
2,510 posts
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Keefy Beefy
When I've done progressive run I do the first 5M however until I get to 20% of MP, and then increase speed by about 5-7 seconds every couple of miles till the last 4 or so are at 10% off MP.
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Nov 2008
9:38pm, 11 Nov 2008
319 posts
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IanRunner
When I did progressive runs using 18/55 schedule I did it to heart rate.
I split the run into 3 sections for some reason, dont ask me why! So for a 18 miler for example. I would stay sub 70% WHR for the first 6 miles then upto 74% then upto 78% for the final 6 miles.
It seemed to work well for me. If you are having an off day it doesnt matter, as you train to how your feeling etc . My long run pace also improved alot while doing this.
Its much better than running to sub 70% WHR as like P&D say it mirrors how you feel in a marathon.
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